Andrew MacDonald
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  • Ottawa,ON
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  • Darrell R. Moneyhon

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If we-space silos formed a we
10 Replies

I'm interested in more conversation around what's happening and what can happen in small groups - and between them. Hungry, in fact, to hear from, talk and converse with other we-space practitioners…Continue

Tags: climate, change, field, we-spaces, groups

Started this discussion. Last reply by Layman Pascal Oct 20, 2013.

Individual work AND collective work
2 Replies

It might seem like a no-brainer to intergralists that we've got to engage the collective mind, that is, swim in it and move in it, as well as do whatever practices we do. But in fact, almost none of…Continue

Tags: practice, groups

Started this discussion. Last reply by Andrew MacDonald May 4, 2010.

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I'm interested in conversation about the transition we're in, evolutionary spirituality, relocalization, EnlightenNext, things we can do, local groups (big one), Transition Towns.

Most of these are explored at:
"They'll never see us coming!"

Andrew MacDonald's Blog

Evolutionary Relocalization

I'm interested in relocalization and how to approach it so as to see the spiritual dimension of the changes we're in. I wrote this piece for my site ( and would love to be in conversation about it.


Evolutionary spirituality has moved me for years now. I don't remember the first stirring that told me that

something big for me was there. One "hit" was first hearing…

Posted on March 29, 2010 at 9:27am — 11 Comments

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At 12:47pm on March 10, 2014, Darrell R. Moneyhon said…

Andrew, No problem. Come back to it when time permits. Yes loooonnng paragraphs. I usually write first drafts that way and then break them down or rewrite a bit in order to make shorter paragraphs. It is easier to read that way, but didn't get around to it in my last two comments. A lot to digest at once. See you whenever you can slip back into this conversation. Thanks for commenting and letting me know "what's up!" 


At 2:28pm on March 4, 2014, Darrell R. Moneyhon said…

Oops, Lost about a third of my comment, due to comment length limit, and don't want to rewrite it. I trust that you get the gist of what I am up to doing. The new thought experiment will be a chapter in the book I am working on now, called Your Third Nature. First nature is natural "wirings" or predisposed ways of each individual. In traditional terms, "how God made you." Second nature is learned things downloaded into the self-structure. Third nature is a proposed integrative capacity which can integrate first and second natures. Traditionally it is called own's spirit, but a secular renaming seems helpful, given folk's occasionaly equating of spirituality with dogmas. My chapter 4 is about a social system which can develop people's third natures. I use the integral LR quad but "quantumize" it by imaginatively locating it within an "ever-unfolding flare" which is the self. In this depth-oriented metaphysical model (the flare), the third nature's home is deep in the flare, closer to the quantum or sub-quantum core which is highly spiritual and non-dual. Third nature is capable then of seeing and moving at all depths of the ever-unfolding flare. Each of the Integral Quads are depth-located and re-named "Quantum Quads." Whether this is an improvement or a complete bastardization of integral thought will, I hope, be hotly debated. Better that than simply ignored. New and improved conceptual models can aid in the enactment of interdependence. Chosing modern metaphors seems preferable to using the old metaphors which have become too associated with rigid dogma, although translation into the old spritual terms seems useful also, since the wisdom or understanding seems to have been there all along, although not sufficiently heeded or utilized. 


At 2:13pm on March 4, 2014, Darrell R. Moneyhon said…

Andrew, Am getting ready to write a "thought experiment" similar to the one about a model community from scratch, but this one is about an intervention to use a small business support network to help empower a struggling community of an inner city variety. If it is capitalism, it is at least the distributive capitalism as Theurj mentions here with Pascal in regards to Jeremy Rifkin's approach. While evolution may take us to social/spiritual interdependence, the resource allocation system supportive of such might well be something akin to the mixture of support system and small businesses in the microinvestment projects of Kiva, etc. seen in the third world countries. This type of capitalism seems from the get-go more intertwined with interdependence that our every-person for themselves brand of small business enactment. Co-ownership is more common in the microinvested businesses. I see no reason why a similar mix of socialism (in its best sense) and capitalism can't be also attempted in our own first world country's third-worldish pockets of poverty. Instead of individual loans, establish a small business support network that pools both financial and human resources to try out small business ventures until successful ones are found. The individual business operators would have the buffer of the investment pool, so that if their particular operation fails, they are recycled back into the pool of resources and try another venture supported by the small business co-op or corporation. Profits would be shared by all parties, so there would be plenty of incentive to do the best each small business operator can to make each individual small business venture work. Outside investors such as from churches who want to sponser positive social transformation systems can also have a share initially, as long as group ownership rolls over to the folks living in the empowerment zone community. The included section or blocks or subcommunity would operate like a single corporation, an "indigenous corporation," in which the person's living there would have a greater share eventually than outside microbusiness investors. Basically Kiva model adapted to impoverished first world environments. The consented-upon interfaith or transfaith spiritual principles could be woven into the indigenous corporation's culture in a manner similar to mission statements, etc, in major modern first world corporations. This would be part of a transcorporate movement which works with existing capitalistic structures to eventually transcend the whole individual ownership thing which seems in the long run to cause unecessary distrust and insufficient cooperation. As soon as people cling to owning things in order to feel "safe," a slow but sure slippery slope along the lines of the spiritual law of deficit is created. This "mine" attitude creates separation and eventual lack of necessary synergy of our team or us. It leaves us divided and conquered by the most clever and ruthless of capitalism's "players." Distrust and insufficient motivation is generated amoung the disenfranchised "losers" in the current system which is reall a "rigged game."  This approach is pro-capitalism now and anti-capitalism on down the road. The goal is to evolve from the illusion of owning things into the reality of sharing resources in a way that gives us all the most bang for our resource bucks, so to speak. Resources need to especially include unique human resources traditionally called human "gifts." The intrinsic reward of actualizing and sharing one's own gifts with the collective will be the eventual main incentive or "payment." A co-evolving culture and consciousness of interdependence will thrive under sufficient conditions of economic empowerment of groups/collectives or "economic unions." New, human-friendly and community-based and community-serving corporations will gradually replace the strictly for-profit types of corporations which rig the game in favor of the wealthy or for "p

What paths lie ahead for religion and spirituality in the 21st Century? How might the insights of modernity and post-modernity impact and inform humanity's ancient wisdom traditions? How are we to enact, together, new spiritual visions – independently, or within our respective traditions – that can respond adequately to the challenges of our times?

This group is for anyone interested in exploring these questions and tracing out the horizons of an integral post-metaphysical spirituality.

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