Simplified "Second Tier" Quiz - Integral Post-Metaphysical Spirituality2024-03-28T21:14:08Zhttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/simplified-second-tier-quiz?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A52262&feed=yes&xn_auth=noHere's a link to the book Pro…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-28:5301756:Comment:525702013-10-28T11:55:11.114ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in;"><a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/process-and-difference">Here's a link</a> to the book <i>Process and Difference,</i> <span style="font-style: normal;">which Keller edited. From her introduction:</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in;"></p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in; font-style: normal;">“He [Griffin] does not however engage Derrida, who coined the term deconstruction, nor Gilles Deleuze, Michel Foucault, Luce Irigaray, or Julia…</p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in;"><a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/process-and-difference">Here's a link</a> to the book <i>Process and Difference,</i> <span style="font-style: normal;">which Keller edited. From her introduction:</span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in;"></p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in; font-style: normal;">“He [Griffin] does not however engage Derrida, who coined the term deconstruction, nor Gilles Deleuze, Michel Foucault, Luce Irigaray, or Julia Kristeva, or indeed any of the French theorists whom one thinks of as originators of the 'deconstructive postmodernism' to which this series offers the preferred alternative. Instead, he disputes with U.S. philosophers like Karl Popper, Wilfrid Sellars, and Keith Campbell. They are no doubt worthy opponents. Yet their questions, terms, and analytic methods simply do not represent what is known as 'deconstruction.' Indeed there is if anything less tolerance between North American philosophy and French deconstruction than between the latter and process thought.”</p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in; font-style: normal;"></p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 0in; font-style: normal;">Although I'd add that as noted elsewhere some North American philosophy does have kinship, like James, Dewey, Mead and Peirce, the predecessors of the cogscipragos.</p> I didn't have time to edit t…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-28:5301756:Comment:525692013-10-28T01:33:27.440ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>I didn't have time to edit the last post so the X above is in reference to Catherine Keller in <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/bill-torbert?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A19313" target="_self">this post</a> and the <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/constructive-and?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A4492" target="_self">one linked</a> therein.</p>
<p>I didn't have time to edit the last post so the X above is in reference to Catherine Keller in <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/bill-torbert?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A19313" target="_self">this post</a> and the <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/constructive-and?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A4492" target="_self">one linked</a> therein.</p> If the recent posts in this t…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-28:5301756:Comment:524722013-10-28T01:15:16.097ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>If the recent posts in this thread (<a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/states-stages-the-wc-lattice-and-the-fold?page=8&commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A52381&x=1#5301756Comment52381" target="_self">here</a> and above) are an accurate variant of a postmetaphysical basis, and if it is a more accurate depiction of what constitutes postformal operations (postop), then it legitimately questions the typical kennilingus formulations as a more sophisticated form of…</p>
<p>If the recent posts in this thread (<a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/states-stages-the-wc-lattice-and-the-fold?page=8&commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A52381&x=1#5301756Comment52381" target="_self">here</a> and above) are an accurate variant of a postmetaphysical basis, and if it is a more accurate depiction of what constitutes postformal operations (postop), then it legitimately questions the typical kennilingus formulations as a more sophisticated form of formal operations (formop). The SD FAQ and article support that formop is indeed the origin of the so-called MGM meme, which argument comes right from the Lingam's mouth.* All of which calls into question any such 'test' of postop if it is based on kennilingus formop assumptions, including those of the MHC, itself the basis for much of these claims. The real/false reason thread focuses on the latter with similar postop alternatives, also erroneously labeled 'green' if not MGM by the metaphysical formopers.</p>
<p>* As is the so-called performative contradition charge against so-called 'green,' itself a formop argument incapable of understanding the type of paraconsistent logic used in the linked posts. Note also in the linked posts that this type of paraconsistent logic is distinguished from "various spin-offs or derivative,** the former of which is lumped in with the latter in kennilingus critiques due to the lack of distinction above.</p>
<p>** See X for this differentiation.</p> Hey LP,
These guys had a 60 i…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-27:5301756:Comment:525652013-10-27T16:34:43.051Zehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/e
<p>Hey LP,</p>
<p>These guys had a 60 item or so multiple choice questionnaire that generated a "psychograph" up to and including Yellow. Instead of indicating whether someone was categorically Blue, Orange, Green, Yellow, etc. The psychograph gauged how much a person accepted or rejected a particular value. I believe they call it a Values Test. They used to have a free download but I don't see it on their site anymore. I may have it on an old laptop...let me know if you want it.…</p>
<p></p>
<p>Hey LP,</p>
<p>These guys had a 60 item or so multiple choice questionnaire that generated a "psychograph" up to and including Yellow. Instead of indicating whether someone was categorically Blue, Orange, Green, Yellow, etc. The psychograph gauged how much a person accepted or rejected a particular value. I believe they call it a Values Test. They used to have a free download but I don't see it on their site anymore. I may have it on an old laptop...let me know if you want it.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.onlinepeoplescan.com/indprofile.asp">http://www.onlinepeoplescan.com/indprofile.asp</a></p>
<p></p> For example, from the latter…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-24:5301756:Comment:522702013-10-24T17:37:22.277ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>For example, from the latter article:</p>
<p>"When compiling and analyzing the data, an interesting dimension came to light -- Yellow false positive. [...] Selections of statements intended to elicit Yellow appear to be reflecting a more sophisticated form of Orange instead. [...] This might explain much of the 'second tier' elitism coming from MGM advocates [...] [that] results in a drive to convince self, and others, of living at 'second tier' (if such a thing actually exists!)" (4-5).</p>
<p>For example, from the latter article:</p>
<p>"When compiling and analyzing the data, an interesting dimension came to light -- Yellow false positive. [...] Selections of statements intended to elicit Yellow appear to be reflecting a more sophisticated form of Orange instead. [...] This might explain much of the 'second tier' elitism coming from MGM advocates [...] [that] results in a drive to convince self, and others, of living at 'second tier' (if such a thing actually exists!)" (4-5).</p> I'm also reminded of this SD…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-24:5301756:Comment:522692013-10-24T17:14:29.275ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>I'm also reminded of <a href="http://spiraldynamics.org/tiers/" target="_blank">this SD FAQ post</a> on tiers. And their <a href="http://www.academia.edu/2014906/Mean_Green_Meme_Boomeritis_Myth" target="_blank">article</a> on the mean green meme, which notes that many who answer questionnaires on being yellow are really orange.</p>
<p>I'm also reminded of <a href="http://spiraldynamics.org/tiers/" target="_blank">this SD FAQ post</a> on tiers. And their <a href="http://www.academia.edu/2014906/Mean_Green_Meme_Boomeritis_Myth" target="_blank">article</a> on the mean green meme, which notes that many who answer questionnaires on being yellow are really orange.</p> "There is a role for more pre…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-22:5301756:Comment:522622013-10-22T02:52:30.754ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>"There is a role for more precise & less precise distinction-making."</p>
<p>Perhaps so. I'll stick to my role and leave the networking and club-making to the more socially adept.</p>
<p>"There is a role for more precise & less precise distinction-making."</p>
<p>Perhaps so. I'll stick to my role and leave the networking and club-making to the more socially adept.</p> There is a role for more prec…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-22:5301756:Comment:524352013-10-22T02:25:44.650ZLayman Pascalhttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/LaymanPascal
<p>There is a role for more precise & less precise distinction-making.</p>
<p>When we are looking to locate (or increase the odds of locating) a high number of participants in the production of a new culture, or second tier holon, then we need to open ourselves beyond narrow cognitive definitions -- as useful as they are in specifying the real thing from its imitations.</p>
<p>It is entirely possible that people some people are aesthetically sensitive prior to their development of personal…</p>
<p>There is a role for more precise & less precise distinction-making.</p>
<p>When we are looking to locate (or increase the odds of locating) a high number of participants in the production of a new culture, or second tier holon, then we need to open ourselves beyond narrow cognitive definitions -- as useful as they are in specifying the real thing from its imitations.</p>
<p>It is entirely possible that people some people are aesthetically sensitive prior to their development of personal capacity. It is likely that some people who are in the "intermediary zone" move closer in by identifying and pondering a certain aspect of their own tendencies. And everyone who can be within second tier also has pre-second-tier systems operating in ways that do not always reveal their own leading edge. All of this is a very broad zone which must be encouraged and utilized apart from the concern to carefully police the border. </p>
<p>We are looking for, in short, quasi-integralites. However I can get Indian status from the government if only my great-grandmother was Cherokee! For social activation purposes we must extend ourselves beyond, but around, what our theories specify as the key cognitive capacities. </p>
<p>This is why I have specified that we are not trying to be "theorycentric" but rather to elicit and encourage the population of people whose tendencies, realized in varying degrees and styles, have tended to encourage the production of a variety of historical theories designed to describe them.</p>
<p>Obviously there is enormous overlap between these tasks... </p>
<p><br/> <cite><br/></cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/simplified-second-tier-quiz?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A52259&xg_source=msg_com_forum#5301756Comment52433"><div class="xg_user_generated"><p></p>
</div>
</blockquote> And this post and following.…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-22:5301756:Comment:524342013-10-22T02:18:25.141ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>And <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/real-and-false-reason?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A47522" target="_self">this post</a> and following. We can see the pattern to my thinking here, a <em>radical</em>* change to the typical notions of 2nd-tier.</p>
<p>* I just had to poke fun at this hackneyed kennilingus expression.</p>
<p>And <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/real-and-false-reason?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A47522" target="_self">this post</a> and following. We can see the pattern to my thinking here, a <em>radical</em>* change to the typical notions of 2nd-tier.</p>
<p>* I just had to poke fun at this hackneyed kennilingus expression.</p> And this post and the one fol…tag:integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com,2013-10-22:5301756:Comment:523242013-10-22T01:55:34.187ZEdward theurj Bergehttp://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/profile/theurj
<p>And <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/integral-theory-conference-2013?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A48320" target="_self">this post</a> and the one following.</p>
<p>And <a href="http://integralpostmetaphysics.ning.com/forum/topics/integral-theory-conference-2013?commentId=5301756%3AComment%3A48320" target="_self">this post</a> and the one following.</p>